Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis has been a sharp awakening for Europe on the last two months on the “Monocle” radio on Andrew Mueller’s Foreign Desk show.
The Prime Minister’s interview:
Andrew Mueller: First of all, and there may be no short answer to it, but is there a way to describe how the last two months have been in trying to be a prime minister of an EU and NATO state?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Were complex and full of challenges. But in every crisis, I would say, I want to see possible opportunities. Sure, the last two months have been, in a sense, a abrupt awakening for the European Unionespecially for those of us who support Europe’s strategic autonomy. I am glad to see that at least some progress has been made regarding the decisions we have made at the European Council level.
Andrew Mueller: Where do you see these opportunities, though? Is it the idea of a more united, more coherent Europe?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: At the end of the day, we must realize that the strategic challenges we need to face require bold decisions. When I talk about bold decisions, I obviously refer to funding, to put money on the table, especially when it comes to defense. For example, I have been in favor of the greatest long fiscal flexibility nationally in order to finance defense spending.
When I first raised this issue, my colleagues were not ready to go on this road. I am glad to see now that progress is being made in this direction. We have a new financial tool, these are loans of 150 billion euros, which is not the most preferred solution in my opinion, but at least it is one step in the right direction. For the first time, I see countries such as Finland openly talking about exploring all ways to finance projects for common interest in European defense.
In a sense, this reminds me a little of the months before we agree on the plan NextGenerationEUwhen many countries were opposed to this idea, to finally agree at the last minute.
Andrew Mueller: But do you think Europe has surpassed, especially in the last two months, and perhaps especially after the speech of US Vice President JD Vance in Munich, the point of considering the United States for granted? Is there now a sense in the ranks of European countries that this relationship may not come back? Maybe Donald Trump is not a small ‘malfunction»;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I think it is almost cliché to point out that for many years Europe considered the security guarantees it had, in the sense that we did not spend what we should have on our defense. Greece is the exception to this rule because of our particular concerns about security. We always spent more than 2% of our GDP on defense. This argument was made by President Trump in 2017, so this is nothing new.
Europe is now unable to replace NATO and the dominant role of the US within the Alliance, in terms of our collective security. Therefore, we must undoubtedly work very hard to keep the United States in this context, while at the same time recognizing that we have to do more to protect ourselves. I believe we are moving in this direction. Maybe not at the pace I would like, but progress has definitely been made.
Andrew Mueller: As for Greece’s particular situation, as you put it in subtlety, do you think that Greece can teach something in Denmark or perhaps in Canada about how to manage difficult relationships with an ally in NATO?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Let’s say that our history with Turkey has been centuries. It is a complicated relationship. But I believe that, at the end of the day, two things must be met: on the one hand, Greece must have very reliable deterrent power in defending our sovereignty and our sovereign rights. That is why we are investing significantly in the modernization of our armed forces.
At the same time, roads must be explored to build a more productive relationship. Even if this means that we do not deal with the complex underlying issue that is at the heart of our difference with Turkey, which is the demarcation of marine zones in the Aegean and the Eastern Mediterranean, where we honestly did not make significant progress.
Therefore, even if we agree that we disagree with important issues, this does not mean that there must be constantly conditions, nor does it mean that we cannot investigate opportunities to strengthen our relationship on other fronts. And, of course, this requires honest and open communication channels, which I think we have created with Turkey at all levels. I believe it is important, even when we disagree, we can openly chat.
Andrew Mueller: But has an extensive debate between EU governments and NATO leaders on how to manage the United States’ fairly threatening threats against the territory of two other members of the Alliance?
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Honestly, we have not yet come to a common position on how to deal with this challenge. If we look at it from Greece’s point of view, for exampleGreece has a strategic partnership with the US. It is a strategic partnership that exceeds the president. It is a partnership I want to cultivate and enhance.
At the same time, I am a member of the European family and a devoted European, so we must also manage the US relationship within the European framework. When we speak, for example, for duties and potential trade wars, I support the approach adopted by the European Commission, which has so far been measured.
I was pleased to see that President Trump decided to do behind his most aggressive tariff measures and give us three months to negotiate, which could lead to a mutually beneficial trade agreement.
Andrew Mueller: But this must be especially … I am sure it is frustrating for any European country involved in it, but for a large shipping country such as Greece, which I think, I think, one -fifth of the world commercial shipping …
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Almost a quarter.
Andrew Mueller: Almost a quarter, indeed. But you can’t draw in the long run without knowing what the United States will do from day to night. So Europe must, and indeed the rest of the world, think about how to reform an international commercial class that will not necessarily have the US in the center of